Jared Flinn:
Jesse, always a pleasure to have you back in the studio.
Jesse Runions:
It's always good to be here. It's an escape from the office.
Jared Flinn:
Well, let's get right to it because, man, 2025 has been interesting to say the least. I think where the market is, we're seeing, just freight tonnage down and, you know, carriers talking and I mean, we hear it on the board, talking about rates lower and getting tougher out there. So wanted to you know, we bring you in and, you you study the market probably more than anybody I know, specifically trucking in bulk. And, wanna talk about even some of the previous podcasts we've had you on, some of the predictions you made. I wanted to see if those are holding as true as you thought. So I'll open it up. What I guess, first off, is the market where you thought it would be right now?
Jesse Runions:
Yes. It was. And I put this in my little, executive economic estimate that I do every year. Even though the American economy throughout past few years has been stable. It's been sound. It's especially after a pandemic, especially after the economy shut down for almost a year, essentially. We're in a good position financially and compared to the rest of the world, and this is a broken record. We're still better than most every other nation in the world.
Jesse Runions:
Now that said, the consumer, which fuels 65 to 70% of our economy, the individual consumer, you and I, have been under significant cost pressures for a long time, and those are coming to bear as, you know, the pandemic cash runs out, opportunistic cash that took advantage of that money being out there. As that plays out, people are feeling the pinch. And when people feel the pinch, they don't spend as much. We are a consumer driven economy, meaning that the consumer drives this economy. Roughly 70% of our GDP is consumer oriented. So it doesn't you have $200 in your wallet. If it's sitting in your wallet, is it doing anything economically? No. You have to spend that money.
Jesse Runions:
That other person has to get $200 in their wallet, and it keeps going. It's kinda like the gift that keeps on giving, if you will.
Jared Flinn:
Mhmm.
Jesse Runions:
And when people slow down their spending, the economy is gonna slow down too. And so what we're seeing right now is kind of the hangover from the pandemic, the post pandemic recovery, and now a resumption of a new kinda normal period. People have houses full of things via Amazon, Walmart dot com, all the other online retailers. The brick and mortar retailers, they don't need to buy a new refrigerator again. They don't need to buy a new TV. They probably got one in every room because they're cheaper than they've ever been. So when people talk about inventories of retailers, it's also important to look at inventory of consumers. Do you plan on making a big appliance purchase, or is everything do you plan you pretty much have everything you need for the next five years.
Jesse Runions:
So that's part of the reason we're seeing a little bit of slowdown. Walmart just put out its quarterly earnings. It was a little lower, and they gave a cautionary guidance for 2025. And in terms of consumer spending, Walmart and Amazon are the bellwethers. They're the ones that's gonna give give the indication of what the trend for consumer spending is. And when they're saying, hey. You know what? We're hunkering down. We don't expect, we don't expect, you know, monumental sales.
Jesse Runions:
We we expect maybe the flat line. So coming into trucking, even though what goes on a truck doesn't go to a store the majority of the time, it supports those industries that directly defend, benefit from that consumer income. So when they're getting less orders and the food space you're seeing is, Cargill's laid off or it's going to lay off 8,000 employees. ADM is going through a right sizing mode.
Jared Flinn:
Tyson.
Jesse Runions:
Tyson, same thing.
Jared Flinn:
So, yeah, I guess that's why I was and, again, I always say I always think we're a little insulated with bulk trucking, you know, providing food, but the food suppliers are cutting back and laying off. Hey, guys. We are getting so much interest for our bulk freight conference twenty twenty five. You know, we started this two years ago. We've had two phenomenal conferences. It keeps getting bigger. Our first conference, we had over 200. This last one, over 500.
Jared Flinn:
We have a lot of people that wanna show up. We wanna make sure that you can get your ticket reserved. It's gonna be the April. We hope that you can make it. But go ahead right now. Go to bulkfreightconference.com and put your email address in there, and we will notify you when tickets go on sale. That way, you will be the first one to be notified before they sell out. It's gonna be amazing show.
Jared Flinn:
We have a new venue that's gonna be even bigger. We're talking actually having show trucks inside the venue, breakout sessions, and, man, just a world best to get you connected. I was just talking yesterday. I had had, dinner with a lady that was at the conference last year and just talked about the connections that she made and the business that she's doing now by meeting those clients face to face. So we want you to be there, and go to bulkfreightconference.com. Enter your email address. Get signed up. It's gonna be phenomenal.
Jared Flinn:
We'll see you there. God bless. But the food suppliers are cutting back and laying off.
Jesse Runions:
Well, here's another thing that I haven't seen reported. Remember, we have an aging demographic and a shrinking demographic. The birth rate has decreased. There's less mouths to feed. And as the baby boomers, fade away into the sunset, to put it kindly, you know, that population level, the the number of mouths to feed shrinks as well. And it's it's not even a percentage point, but, you know, it adds up over time. So you have that. And then the pandemic era, you know, food producers were kinda like a lot of trucking companies.
Jesse Runions:
Hey. This is gonna last forever, and they built these productive capacities to stay in perpetuity when they probably shouldn't. Now they're having to play catch up and like everybody else's about what's in the bank account. Cash. Cash. Cash. So they're they're cut trimming their payrolls to get their cash balances where they need so they can pay bills and stay in business. So so they're playing catch up, but it's gonna be painful because it it hurts every part of the truck and market, especially the bulk space.
Jesse Runions:
So far, I haven't seen the thing I pay attention to in bulk commodity hopper is used hopper prices. So far, those used prices are staying high. As a part of that, the mainline manufacturers have probably slowed down their their newer production a little bit. But so there's still people buying used trailers, which suggests we still have new entrants. But Interesting. You know, how long that lasts. I don't think it'll last past July or August. Do you
Jared Flinn:
have a pulse on the on truck sales?
Jesse Runions:
I pay attention to it, but I don't
Jared Flinn:
kind of ballpark you know is that's about the same or is that
Jesse Runions:
Oh, that that's went down. New truck sales. Now I expect to surge this year. Used truck prices? Used truck prices are coming up a little bit, and that's because of the 2027 EPA standards. Now you know, you'd be getting the political spectrum. There are those that think Trump will get rid of that. Maybe he will. Maybe he won't.
Jesse Runions:
You know, there were those that thought that the Trump every other president kicked the ELD problem down the road. 2017, Trump did not. So I don't know if that that EPA standard is gonna be kicked to the the side. And two, the manufacturers are already tooling up and probably starting to make some preproduction issues to line up for that. So if it happens now, then engine manufacturers are gonna be at a disadvantage. So it's a, you know, it's a a Hobson's choice, you know, or darned if you do, darned if you don't, to put it kindly.
Jared Flinn:
I want to go back to the agribusiness part of it and explain, because I know, like, we have the population hasn't declined that much in just two years. I mean, I know you said less mouths to feed, but why are so many of these companies really laying off? Okay. I Resulting in less I
Jesse Runions:
kind of skipped over this. So the pandemic period twenty to twenty one, most of us were at home or restaurants were closed. We weren't eating out as much. We were cooking at home more. A home is not as efficient in cooking, in preparing food than a business that does so. Restaurants have less wastage than you and I would have if we were cooking ourselves from scratch, you know, actual cooking. So they don't have the wastage. And even the waste that they have, a lot of it comes back into the the feed supply chain via DARPAO and a host of others that make different recycled products from the French fry oil that's, becomes an ingredient.
Jesse Runions:
The the the different carbohydrates that gets fed into their their cookie meal products. So part of it is food production is now going back to the more efficient stream. So that accounts for a big part of the sales drops in consumer food. Even though we're paying more at the restaurant for the food, we're actually not buying as much food per meal. And, and there's probably a lot of other factors, but that's that's one that comes to my mind first, and I really haven't seen it reported on much.
Jared Flinn:
So that's bulk I mean, I'm just saying just an example. So that's backing up to less chicken being bought from the store or what are Absolutely. So less chickens to feed, less feed to deliver.
Jesse Runions:
You know, when you cook fried chicken at home or chicken and dumplings and you have leftovers, what happens? They go in the fridge. In the average household, do those leftovers ever fully get consumed? Probably not. And the difference is, again, to the restaurant side of things, you know, the smaller restaurants may not do this, but the bigger chain certainly do. When they have waste products, that is going into more than likely a re a recycling of the into the feed supply chain.
Jared Flinn:
Because they've got to be as efficient as possible to make money.
Jesse Runions:
So they're getting money from that recycled waste or at the very least, they're paying a minimal disposal fee for it. And then that producer goes and produces, you know, like I say cookie meal, poultry, byproduct meals, etcetera, etcetera.
Jared Flinn:
Okay. I want to get to this because I want to hear kind of, you know, we got the crystal ball out here, future predictions. But one thing it's been painful to see is like, we're now starting to see some of our bulk carriers out of business. There was one just a couple weeks ago, guy I know a friend, man, was running six, seven trucks and, announced on social media that they had to close their doors. And, again, I was just surprised that that's happening in our space.
Jesse Runions:
And, again, it goes back to food production slowing down, and that's a con that's a direct consumer product. And, again, even though we don't haul always directly to the producer, even in the bulk space, that's 70% of our business directly or indirectly. And when that shrinks, well, freight demand shrinks too. So we're probably gonna see more of that. I I don't see a massive drop in freight demand for, bulk commodity food feed, pet food grade. Pet food will probably hold steady. I don't know about your dog, but my dog tries to eat more, not less. So, but feed grade and food grade, you're you're gonna see that.
Jesse Runions:
But the problem is, especially in the food grade and the higher end feed grade, people are gonna try to push that in the pet food grade side that meets the standards. So we're probably gonna experience a little minor I don't wanna say trucking recession, but it's gonna feel like it. You know? And, again, it'll we were insulated from the mainline carriers that were directly tied to consumer demand
Jared Flinn:
Yeah.
Jesse Runions:
You know, the first or second level. And, you know, now it's our turn. So but like I say, I don't see the rates falling like they were because the problem for the bulk commodity space in a hopper or a pneumatic, you're dragging a parachute down the road. The best fuel mileage you're gonna get if you're doing everything right six, six and a half. Yeah. The average is probably five, five and a half. So the cost per mile is unchanged. There's no disinflationary pressures there.
Jesse Runions:
Repairs are still costing more. Parts are costing more. Parts availability is gonna be an issue again? It's not it again. It's been there. It's not it it hasn't went away since the pandemic, and this goes to companies are prioritizing what parts they're making. And so, a truck factory is probably gonna get first dibs on parts from Cummins or Detroit, and the the parts supply chain is gonna have a lower tier. And if you have an older engine, you know, like us at ERB, we run a lot of older equipment because, quite frankly, it's more rugged than newer equipment. And, you know, we we have to pay that in the parts and repair side.
Jesse Runions:
But our our availability, per truck is still higher than the newer truck. So but, you know, an older Caterpillar engine, a thirty four zero six or first flight, ACERT engine, you're gonna see the part stream on that go more aftermarket instead of cat sourced party, parts. And so parts availability, whether it's new or old, is gonna start become becoming more problematic, and it's just gonna depend on what's selling more on on the older truck parts. Caterpillar still for hopper, probably the number one brand because it takes the abuse. Now me, I was always a poor man. I liked Detroit. So, it was cheaper to work on. It was easier to work on.
Jared Flinn:
But you're saying overall though, there's really been no reduction in costs?
Jesse Runions:
Other than fuel, fuel has eased a little bit. But But
Jared Flinn:
everything else is the same because you said the trailers, truck parts
Jesse Runions:
So far the cost
Jared Flinn:
of the trailers
Jesse Runions:
are still high. Now you got to remember, a trailer is not a true expense. When you buy a trailer, you know, all that's an expense. No. You're buying an asset for your productivity. Now the the expense of that comes in the depreciation side of you divided over time, typically five years. Yeah. So you spend 50,000 for a used trailer.
Jesse Runions:
The expense part is 10,000 a year. But, and that does get in semantics when it comes out of your account or you're getting a note for it and you're paying that loan to pay back. You're not gonna separate the principal from the interest expense to see what's expensed and what's paying off a liability or
Garrett Foxx:
a
Jared Flinn:
loan. Well, to getting back to because again, the premise of having the in there is really trying to see, what the rest of 2025 is going to shape out to be. One thing too, and we might get into a hornet's nest here, but, like, we when you look at some of the stuff going on with these tariffs, and we last time you're on, we we briefly talked on this, but now we're seeing these tariffs. So what change is that gonna have domestically? Because, again, US is still a major exporter of grain. A lot of our haulers obviously move grain and and different ingredients. But does that change anything for trucking?
Jesse Runions:
Explored grain, I don't see that changing much. And then because the biggest buyers, People's Republic Of China, they've already handed the Sejarra Vaseline last year when they canceled orders. They can't afford to cancel many more orders.
Jared Flinn:
They can't buy it somewhere else?
Jesse Runions:
Well, they are buying elsewhere, Brazil. But in Brazil, they had to suspend shipments for irregularities. Now most of those shipments were coming from American, either a partner companies or owned company. So I don't know if it's just because they were the biggest player in the market.
Jared Flinn:
It was still essentially coming from America from you?
Jesse Runions:
From American companies that are based in Brazil. So I don't know if it was a geopolitical thing or they had some bad soybean meal or either didn't have the protein comment content or too much of a toxin. So but those shipments were suspended for irregularities, whatever they were. So but so the best quality export products still comes from The United States by and large. Soybean meal, all the different byproducts. Our standards are still higher than Brazil's. So and China knows that. So when, you know, if you got a high quality soybean meal as an ingredient, your poultry production, your pork production is gonna be higher, you know, per ton of product, you know, ingredient input purchased.
Jesse Runions:
And two, they've already cut where they can't cut anymore. You know, there are other producers, but they can only pick up so much of the slack. We're still one of the biggest food producers in the world. And then when it comes to feedstock, we're pretty close to number one, and that varies depending on the the calendar month of the year because Brazil, Australia, Argentina, they're in the Southern Hemisphere. So when we're our production's off, theirs is up. And so and that go you know, ties into exports too. But China has cut about as far as they cut in terms of feed ingredient imports into their country. So I do not see them cutting anything until closer to our harvest time.
Jesse Runions:
Then if they wanna do a retaliation, they may do it if they have a bumper crop. But if they don't and they're still in the same boat, you probably won't see the repeat of the retaliation that we've seen in 2018. China under Chi is not China under Mao. Forty million people are not gonna let them starve they're not gonna just willingly starve to death.
Jared Flinn:
You know? So again, back to so the I mean, really, I wanna say regardless, but we shouldn't see a change or impact in grain supply or grain movement.
Jesse Runions:
We probably will, but it's you know, the indirect impact. So it'll be more, because of the consumer in income has been impacted negatively. More domestic. It it'll be more domestic problems. If you notice China's retaliation against us, this go around, there were no agricultural commodities. They went after, you know, electronics, chips, that kind of thing. The the actual hard producing or hard production, manufactured production.
Jared Flinn:
So again, I'm kind of thumbing around here, but going back to trucking and bulk trucking. And and our guys listening, like, when you're you know, we're now we're getting to the end of the first quarter.
Jesse Runions:
It'll be flat at best. You're not going to see any monumental growth. I don't think you're going to see, severe disruptions, but we're going
Jared Flinn:
to feel pain. For businesses out there that are feeling the pain right now, these trucking companies, again, I mentioned Guide, you know, one, but there I mean, I know there's been many more, but if you're a company truck owner right now, and man, you're right there, or they mean, it's getting tight. I guess what I'm pointing is, like, how do we is there a way to nip this in the butt before you're throw up the red flag and be like, hey. I got us, you know Okay.
Jesse Runions:
It goes back to good business basics. Number one thing, you know, a business owner or small business owner should do. Once a month when that bank statement comes in, balance your checkbook, no amount how much money you actually got. Okay. You're not an accountant. You don't know how to do a cash flow with indirect or direct method. No problem. Look at the top of that bank statement.
Jesse Runions:
See how much money is coming in, how much is going out in that month. Identify what your actual cash flow is in the company. And if you got more cash going out, identify what's earning that cash and see what you can do to control those costs. You know, if it's fuel, you may wanna look at trying to become a little more efficient. You know, don't run as fast down the road. As much as many people disagree, air resistance creates drag, drag creates fuel consumption.
Jared Flinn:
So it can be I mean, I'm a stop you there. So it can be just as practical. It'd be like because, again, I don't say it's gonna be just one thing. You're gonna be like, oh, here's where all the money's getting burned, dude. It's all these little things. But one could be looking at the fuel expenditure and being like, hey. You know, I can't control the price of fuel, but I can control a little bit of the consumption. Exactly.
Jared Flinn:
So just even as hard as it may be and painful slowing that rig down.
Jesse Runions:
And, you know, on, repairs, you know, the things you can do that you don't have to send it to a shop too, changing the oil, the filters. That's something anybody can do. You don't want your drivers going into the Luvs to change a fuel filter. You know, $40 worth of parts, but it's gonna cost you a hundred and $70 to have it done at a the things that you do not have to outsource for repair, I recommend not doing it. Again, it gets between time balance. What do you have the time to do? So you have to balance that. But when it comes to cash, what's more important? You spend an extra hour in a day changing on a Saturday, changing the oil in that truck versus going to any, you know, Speedco, a TA, a local shop and spending $400 to $600 to have the same thing done with it you can do under $300
Jared Flinn:
A lot of it is just even changing your habit. And maybe you're not used to doing that on a weekend or Saturday. Yeah. But like
Jesse Runions:
Oh yeah. Hey, I used to drive. There was weeks I'd come in after a hard week. The last thing I want, I didn't even want to look at that truck. See, you know, catch on fire for all I care. I get that. But again, you know, the majority of us in this business, you lose the business. That's your house.
Jesse Runions:
That's your livelihood. Yeah. That's what
Jared Flinn:
I think. Because dude, it seriously pains me. And that's why I wanna get nitty on this nitty gritty talking
Tanner Batten:
about it.
Jesse Runions:
Well, that's the reason I say step one, balance your checkbook. You know? Okay. And I'm going to throw out that nasty word, accounting, accounting, accounting. You don't have to be a CPA to do your own accounting. There's plenty of resources out there to teach you what's, what's the difference between a liability and expense or an asset or income. And, you know, QuickBooks online, $35 a month, and you got a a full accounting suite there. It actually enables you to do bill pay and receive payments electronically too. Now you gotta be careful there.
Jesse Runions:
There is a fee associated with that. Sometimes they get all waiting an extra three or four days for a hard paper check versus taking a cut on your revenue Yeah. Is or or impacting your customer with a a pay fee. So, you know, those are things you have to do, but, again, build a system of accounting. It doesn't matter whether it's QuickBooks or a spreadsheet, but identify your cost, track your cost, track your cost per truck. Know what's going out the door. Know where your money is burning and know where it's turning. So and then Over the years, I would
Jared Flinn:
just say and just kinda off the cuff here, you mentioned some really good ones. Again, just the fuel aspect of it, even the maintenance aspect of it. Are there
Jesse Runions:
other little ones that you could probably Tire inflation. What blows a tire more often is not? Somebody didn't check the air pressure. It was under 70 pounds, 80 pounds. That's a pretty hard.
Jared Flinn:
Pre trips more.
Jesse Runions:
Yeah. If you can catch something in your driveway, it's gonna be a heck of a lot cheaper than it will on the side of a road. You can't even get a road call, a road service call now less than a thousand. So when that if a truck has a blowout, the filter plugs up on the side of the road, you're gonna spend a thousand dollars for that road call no matter what's a $600 tire or $40 filter.
Jared Flinn:
You know what I thought was interesting? When I was, I did our video with Earl Martin, that we featured. It's on our video, what we'll do it. But, like, it was interesting. They run a bunch of these over the road tow trucks, you know, recovering heavy duty. He said they had record business during COVID because the rates were so high. These guys didn't care about maintenance as much.
Jesse Runions:
Well, they didn't have time too.
Jared Flinn:
They didn't have time. So it was it was more I mean, they did the math, and it was, to a certain extent, better just to keep running and run that truck because if it broke down somewhere out, you know, dude, they could afford to bring it back where now I mean, that you can't afford that tow bill.
Jesse Runions:
Even in BRB, twenty twenty two's revenue and late that latter half of twenty one's revenue was off the chart, but all the expenses associated with that revenue, it was not in terms of net income. I dare say most trucking companies and any of the big boys I looked at on their their p and l's, they were in the same boat as everybody else. You made direct revenue, but you were doing record expenses. So, you know, you know, I'm sure your mom told you this too. It's not how much you make, it's how much you spend, and that it's true. But, again, how many people, know I need to go buy this? They just look at that bank balance, own their phone app, or log in to the bank cash
Garrett Foxx:
they have.
Jesse Runions:
How much cash the bank is showing today, but it does not account for outstanding checks. So they don't know how much the real cash is. Balance the checkbook and keep track of what what's going out. Know what your real cash level today. If everything cleared right now, what's your real cash level?
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. This isn't very sexy stuff. No.
Jesse Runions:
It's not sexy, but it's not rocket science. Everybody's afraid of accounting. If you can do two plus two and come out with four, you're qualified. Now if you can come out with seven, you may wanna go for your CPA.
Jared Flinn:
But oh,
Jesse Runions:
I say and, yes, you can get your CPA to do your accounting for it. Most firms do have a a QuickBooks maintenance or an accounting support services arm. If that's cost effective, do that. But make sure if you have an outside firm do your accounting, make sure they know trucking. Because if they don't, you buy a set of tires and you spend $4, they wanna capitalize that so it doesn't hit your p and l as an expense, but a repair is a repair is a repair. That should never be an asset being depreciated is you're gonna get what? Year, year and a half on tires. The shortest life, depreciation life typically is five years. You're not gonna get five years on tires.
Jesse Runions:
So staying in that vein, most accounting firms, if they don't know the business, they see something more than a thousand dollars or wanting to put it on the the asset sheet, you know, under your fixed assets or other assets and then depreciate it. So, again, if you outsource your accounting needs, make sure that the accounting firm knows trucking. And if not, educate them. You're a client. You're paying bills. No. This is gonna be an expense. This is why it won't last five years.
Jesse Runions:
It will not last the depreciation life. Make sure this is on my p and l so I can see how much money I'm not gaining from this expense.
Jared Flinn:
So buckle up for 20 20 5. Buckle up. Fasten your seat belts. All the way through.
Jesse Runions:
All the way through. And it's probably gonna get more exciting as we go.
Jared Flinn:
Do Do you think with some of the stuff that, that's going on in Washington right now, that'll have a positive or negative effect on truck freight?
Jesse Runions:
Initially, yes. And here's the thing, and this is the truth. I don't care what politician says otherwise. We run this economy. The presidents don't. Congress members don't. They spend money. Even when they're trying to save money, they're spending money.
Jesse Runions:
We're the ones that make this economy work, 340,000,000 of us, by spending money, investing smartly. What congress the the executive branch, I don't care who's in office, they do two things and do two things very well. They tax and they spend. And they can tell you anything you want to hear. And don't don't be the teenager on prom night, and I'll leave it at that. You were they're all you know, you're being told what you wanna hear so the other guy can get what they want. Don't do it. So again, use your head.
Jesse Runions:
Every business owner in the bulk space, you're here because you're smart. Use your head. Don't listen to all the junk on the radio or the TV. Look at your is the speaker of the house, Johnson, president Trump, he's not gonna come help you balance your checkbook or show you where you can find new income. You have to do that. So, typically, when governments create policies, it's the little guy and, eventually, the corporation comes behind us, you know, comes behind small business. Most policies have unintended consequences, and they usually the unintended consequences usually hit the people that don't have lobbyists on K Street. So what happens? The small business owner, oh, well, you know, I got this obstacle.
Jesse Runions:
You don't go over it. You go around it. Twenty twenty six, all the obstacles intentionally or unintentionally that's been put in our way, we're gonna start figuring out how to go around them. Nobody because you don't have a choice. You know, that's a no choice is a heck of a motivator. So each small business owner, each small trucking company owner is gonna do things to survive because the farm, the house, the family rides on that company staying up. And then, you know, a a bigger fleet, not only does the the owner's family reside on that, every driver's family is dependent on that business owner to make good decisions, the best decisions possible. And when there's something in your way, you're the road runner.
Jesse Runions:
You're going around.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. Wow. That's so good when you put it down into practical terms like that, that, you know, three forty million people are really the one driving this economy.
Jesse Runions:
We're the one that drives this economy. We're the one that drives governments. And sometimes we have to remind governments, hey, you know what? You're our employees. You know? So the political aspect, my attitude is wait and see. You know, just to make a little humor here, I rode in my dog the last two elections because I don't think either party's given me the choice, me personally, that I shoulda had, and that's that. But politics, that's fluff. The the economy rides in our hands. And, sure, the governments will create policies that are sometimes helpful, but in trucking, when have we ever really got a helpful policy? ELD, that can could have been kicked down a road like the previous four administrations didn't happen.
Jesse Runions:
EPA mandates. Trucking has one of the highest EPA hurdles across over any industry besides power production. So we most of the policies that governments create where we're concerned are usually negatives. So don't don't have this soul. The the sky is gonna bright and everything's gonna be great. If it does, then you're pleasantly surprised. Yeah. It's interesting when
Jared Flinn:
you talk about the EPA stuff because regardless again, I'm not saying for against, but regardless of what happens, it's a it's a level playing field for everybody. So everybody's gotta adapt to those rules. So it doesn't really
Garrett Foxx:
Yeah.
Jared Flinn:
And It's not it's not gonna be there's gonna be a winner of this and a loser of this.
Jesse Runions:
But, again, in it on this, especially a small business owner because he has no choice when government, state, county, whoever puts an obstacle in front of you, you're gonna go around it. If not, you're that's the end of trucking. You're gonna do something else. Yeah. Wow. And sometimes that's not a bad thing either. So, you know Yeah.
Jared Flinn:
Well, it's been great. Just just to kinda end this, and, it's always interesting bringing in because it's like we we rehash some of the same things, but it's always the same response.
Jesse Runions:
My life is a broken record. No.
Jared Flinn:
But it's true, though. I think it's kinda it's kinda drilling just those practical lessons of, man, if when I mean, it's harder in these times, but it's like the same things of managing your cause.
Jesse Runions:
And then, you know, like I say, most important thing you're gonna have, and then and like I say, it's not sexy, it's not glamorous, is that accounting framework. Because really the most important thing you should do every day is look at that profit and loss. Am I making money today? Am I not? And then identify what's eating the profit. And, again, the equal importance, see where that cash is. Know where that cash is if every check that you have outstanding cleared. Know what your real cash level is. Because in the end, an income statement is an opinion. Your bank account's a fact.
Jared Flinn:
We'll leave it at that. Jesse, as always, man, appreciate you coming on. Thank you. We'll see you at the conference coming up soon. So, yeah, if you haven't yet, make sure and get your conference tickets, bulkfreeconference.com. We've, we're I think we'll be double the size. So you spoke last year. I'm not gonna make you do it this year.
Jared Flinn:
Although you were super valuable, we're bringing in a couple other, economists to kind of spread it
Jesse Runions:
out and get some Experts in other words.
Jared Flinn:
No. No. Absolutely. I I think I didn't wanna put the burden on you, but, you did a phenomenal job. I'm sure, though, you'll be, be able to give us some good feedback.
Jesse Runions:
So The thing about the Bulk Freight Conference is it's one of the few venues where you have shippers, carriers, and vendors all under the same roof. Usually, it's just one or it's the other. Yeah. Of course, there's always vendors who are always wanting to sell you something. But It's always an agenda. Well, why are we trucking? The agenda is to make a livelihood and
Garrett Foxx:
Yeah. Sure.
Jesse Runions:
Eventually change our names to Clapett and move to Beverly Hills. So Yeah. Well, awesome.
Jared Flinn:
Thank you for saying that. God bless you.
Jesse Runions:
Appreciate it. Have a good one.
Garrett Foxx:
Hey guys. Thanks for watching the bulk loads podcast. I hope you enjoyed the episode. I got Tanner with me.
Tanner Batten:
Hey everybody.
Garrett Foxx:
Tyler and Jared are out this week. So as I joked about yesterday, they called on the the backup squad. Yeah. They,
Tanner Batten:
they really wanted the heavy hitters in here today for Garrett went around the office and just saw anyone he could pull in here, and that's how he ended up with me.
Garrett Foxx:
Pretty much.
Jared Flinn:
Pretty much.
Garrett Foxx:
Yeah. Well, Jesse was on today, and obviously some really great insight anytime he's on. I mean, I don't think I don't understand half of what he's saying just cause it's, it's so smart and he puts so much time and effort into the work that he does. But, I know all the guys enjoy hearing about the statistics and the predictions that he's got and just kind of the, the root cause of a lot of the the things going on in the industry.
Tanner Batten:
Yeah. No. I learned something every time I listened to Jesse, and like Garrett said, even some of it's over our head, but, yeah, we're we're thankful to have that. And hopefully, you know, no one can predict the future, but good to just have an outlook and hopefully make some plans, you know, for 2025.
Garrett Foxx:
Yeah. Absolutely. And then speaking of 2025, you were just talking about a lot of guys are kinda reaching out to you, looking to kinda change some things up or making sure they're in compliance. And
Tanner Batten:
Yeah. Yeah. No. Yeah. Twenty twenty five started out well on the permitting side. You know, just in general have had a lot more guys kinda interested whether they're leased on or, you know, they're farming and they're thinking about kinda going commercial. But a lot of guys just kind of inquiring still about, hey. What's it take to get out on my own? You know, what all do I need to do, to stay compliant? And then I've actually had a lot of people looking to expand their operation in the new year.
Tanner Batten:
So a lot of guys running intrastate, looking for more opportunities, more loads, and going interstate. You know? So, obviously, there's some more boxes you gotta check, more forms you gotta fill out, which is where I come in, because most people don't like
Garrett Foxx:
Yeah. The fun stuff.
Tanner Batten:
Yeah. All the fun stuff. So, it's been good and just seems like a lot of people are feeling a little more optimistic about the new year, and are looking to kind of expand their opportunities, or start a brand new company in the new year. So it's it's been a good start to the year
Garrett Foxx:
so far. Yeah. Well, that's awesome. Well, if you guys have any interest in that, feel free to reach out to Tanner. Bulkloads will get you set up or answer any questions that you might got. Absolutely. And then obviously with the podcast, there's a couple of changes we've been doing. If you've been watching for a little while now, you'll notice we're not really doing an intro anymore.
Garrett Foxx:
We're just kinda jumping straight into the episode just because that's what, you know, most of you guys are here to see. And then also here in the next few weeks or so, we're gonna switch to more of a biweekly schedule. And purpose of that is just because we really wanna focus on getting the best quality guests that we can, which obviously takes a little bit longer time.
Jared Flinn:
Mhmm.
Garrett Foxx:
And then also too, I mean, we're really focusing on trying to shy away from a lot of the virtual ones. And if they can't get into the studio, Jared will be traveling to them if it's someone that, you know, we're really wanting to get on and think there's a there's a lot of benefit for, some for you guys as well. So, just wanted to kinda update you on that. And then, obviously, we've got the conference coming up. That's the biggest talk of the town around the office. So
Tanner Batten:
Absolutely. Absolutely. It's coming up quicker and quicker, and I know, yeah, we're excited. I mean, last year was amazing, and we had an awesome turnout. And I think this year is is shaping up to be even better. So make sure you get your tickets because they're going like hotcakes
Jared Flinn:
Yeah.
Tanner Batten:
And, the hotel's filling up as well. So we're trying to spread the word, and, obviously, you know, it's tough. We know for a lot of people in this industry of, like,
Jesse Runions:
I don't
Tanner Batten:
know what my life's gonna look like in a month, or how do you expect me to take three days off work? But we have planned in a lot of time, work breaks, bring your laptop, dispatch a couple loads, sit in for a couple seminars, you know, answer your drivers or, you know, book some loads for next week. Everyone's gonna be doing it. So we just wanna encourage everyone to find a way to get there, because there's gonna be a lot of great content, and we're obviously really excited.
Garrett Foxx:
Yeah. No. Absolutely. I think hit the nail right on the head there. I know the biggest thing is really focusing. I mean, this is one of those opportunities to really not invest just in your business, but in yourself and your personal success and everything. So there's a lot of benefits that come out of this and we're really trying to line up the best speakers for you that we think can do that. So, yeah, I'm super excited.
Garrett Foxx:
It's gonna be a big, big upgrade from last year. And last year was even like you said, last year was awesome. So Yep. Yep. Excited for that. Well, yeah. Well, again, appreciate you guys tuning in. If you guys have any thing, just feel free.
Garrett Foxx:
We're obviously, I know we do a prayer for anything in the industry or any of our users, anyone that reaches out. So if you guys have any prayers or any needs like that, please just reach out at,
[email protected], and we would love to pray for you. Obviously, that's not gonna get shared anywhere. That's just an internal thing that we do just because, we know we're faith based company. So Absolutely. Really important to us. So, Tanner, if you wouldn't mind praying for me.
Tanner Batten:
Yeah. I'll close this out. Let's pray. Dear god, we're just so thankful for everything you give us, lord, and we just know that, every good thing comes from you. God, we just pray over, all of our members, lord, all those listening. We just pray for protection, as they're on the road and traveling. We pray for, just a good year, god, and just provision over those. And, god, for anyone who's struggling, whether it's physically or financially, god, we just pray, that you would watch over them and, that you would just, again, provide for them in this new year, God.
Tanner Batten:
We thank you for everything you give us and just ask that we would be able to shine your light in everything we do. In your name. Amen.
Garrett Foxx:
Amen. Thank you, Tanner. Well, again, thanks for tuning in. If you guys learned anything, feel free. We'd love it. If you shared it around with any of your friends in the industry, and we'd love to kind of grow the channel. That's the best way to do it. And thanks for tuning in and we'll see you a couple of weeks.
Jared Flinn:
Weeks.
