Jared Flinn:
You're listening to the bulk loads podcast. Your number 1 resource for everything bold freight trucking.
Jared Flinn:
Hey, guys. Jared Flynn with the Bulk Loads podcast. Get telly with me.
Tyler Allison:
What's going on?
Jared Flinn:
Oh, man. Do you have a good 4th?
Tyler Allison:
Oh, yeah. Yeah. It was a lot of fun. Fort July is my favorite holiday. So
Jared Flinn:
You have all your fingers?
Tyler Allison:
I do. I do. I know.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. We, yeah. Great time. A lot of people and, just an amazing event. So I always wish, like, there's some, you know, Christmas time, like, you have, like, the whole month. I feel like 4th July. Like, we should keep celebrating all through July.
Tyler Allison:
Will we change
Jared Flinn:
America, patriotism.
Tyler Allison:
We changed the bulk loads logo for this month. Yeah. In white and blue on our socials, just yet to show the how patriotic we are around here. But I agree. I'd rather, like, let's celebrate the whole month.
Jared Flinn:
Do Do we still have shirts available?
Tyler Allison:
We do. Yep. I think we are starting to run low, but I think we have about a 100 left. So we wanna get them out the door to you. If you still want 1, we'll link it below. Joe will put the link in the description. Simply go and, claim 1, and we'll send it out to you.
Jared Flinn:
Charge. No charge. You even pay for the shipping. Yep. And, they're actually really comfortable shirts. Like, they're super soft.
Tyler Allison:
Yeah. I've got a lot of people, complimenting them, and message on Facebook that they're receiving and everything. Everyone's, happy that they're getting them.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. So cool. But yeah, drop down, get 1 super simple. May take you 30 seconds to fill out that. We'll we'll drop 1, to you. Also, oh, I wanted to say this man, Dan Redding, we sent him some semi Sam books.
Malcolm Smith:
Oh, yeah.
Jared Flinn:
And he'd sent some pictures of, they had it in their parade, the July parade, which was just awesome. I'm always honored, to be a part of that and to share semi Sam with those out there. And, Joe, he'll throw up some photos if you wanna see the parade and and some of the photos, giving them out to the kids. But, yeah, Dan, thanks for doing that. I've actually got some other requests, and I just wanna throw that out there. If you would like, we did the semi Sam books really to just, inform the industry more about, and especially children, the benefits and, details of agriculture and trucking. So, reach out to us if you have an event or, your kid's classroom. Yep.
Jared Flinn:
Any, groups or organizations that they're in, we'd be glad to ship you some of those that you can give out.
Tyler Allison:
Yeah. Or simply just have a grand, a grandchild or a son or daughter who would be interested in in just a single book. We'll we'll ship you 1 off as well.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. Just send it to podcast at bulkloads.com and, yeah, we'll get you some semi sand books. So, yeah, Dan, thank you so much, for doing that and getting those out there. So, I'll let you kick it away with
Tyler Allison:
the, truck feature. Today's truck feature, we have, Wade Riffey with Riffey Transport out of Reed Reedsburg, Wisconsin. Wade's been a member since 2013, so almost our beginning. So we thank you Wade so much for your support and being with us. But this is SharpRig. Yeah. I'm pulling a built trailer there. Yeah.
Tyler Allison:
I'm finally glad we're exploring the other trailer options here.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. I'll say a couple of things about Wade Riffey, and I'm gonna have Joe throw up another picture from the Mid America Truck Show. But Wade was there, met him for the first time. Again, have been talking with him since our very beginning back in 2011. He's always been a huge supporter, but, I'll say this, he's done really well. We had him on the podcast. I can't remember how long ago we can look up that episode, but started a transloading business. Yep.
Jared Flinn:
But, again, I'm always get excited when you see people like that that are see these other opportunities
Tyler Allison:
to grow
Jared Flinn:
their own business. But, yeah, he's got his own tran another transloading business along with the trucking company, and they are killing it. So, yeah, Wade, congratulations out there. Thanks for sharing the photo.
Tyler Allison:
Yep. Awesome. Again, if you guys want your, truck featured on here, definitely send us a photo on our social media pages, comment below, or, simply just email them at
[email protected], and we'd love to feature you.
Jared Flinn:
Onto the show today, we're gonna have Malcolm Smith. He is with the National Dump Truck Association. And, I was referred to bring Malcolm on, and, I'm glad I did. As you all know, we so bulk loads, we don't do dump trucks on our site, but we have a lot of members that run-in dumps that also run dump trucks locally. So we wanted to bring Malcolm on the show just to talk about what they're doing, the awareness that they're spreading out there, things that they do regulatory to help promote dump truck, dump trucking in the United States.
Tyler Allison:
Yeah. Yeah. It was a good episode. Malcolm, we won't dive into all the details, but I like how he kinda highlighted just the brought to attention the bad business in the industry. Yeah. And we that kind of coincides with what we've seen a little bit within the bulk industry, ourselves. So I like that he was able to bring that up, just the seasonality of it, and also how to if you're running a dump truck or starting a dump truck company, how to prepare, for the seasonality of it and how what you can do in the off season to still be consistent and work.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. We'll dissect a little bit that, after the show here. So cool. With that said, here is my conversation with Malcolm Smith with the National Dump Truck Association. Malcolm, thanks for joining. Thank you for having
Malcolm Smith:
me.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. Well, man, just give us that, elevator pitch. What is the National Dump Trucking Association?
Malcolm Smith:
Well, the National Dump Trucking Association is the first and only organization that represents the dump trucking professionals on a national scale. So and we do that by way of, education, get them access to resources, and get them opportunities once their their business is set up and and, you know, set up to look presentable for to go at the opportunities such as government contracting, DOT work, state and local contracts, and also private contracts as well. But it's pretty much what we are with the ecosystem for dump trucking excellence.
Jared Flinn:
And I know you guys are based out of the Atlanta area. Does your association does it how far does it stretch across the US?
Malcolm Smith:
Oh, it's in every state. We have, we we we're not we haven't touched every state just yet. We're still getting, you know, getting members. We're not in Maine or anything like that, but it's definitely the Southeast, Texas, California. We've we've touched on I I have to check the records, but we we we're at least 40 states.
Jared Flinn:
Okay. Awesome.
Malcolm Smith:
Yes.
Jared Flinn:
Well, you're not just the CEO, but, I mean, you're also still an owner of a dump trucking company. Right? I mean, that's kinda where this led to. But really talk about the why behind starting the National Dump Truck Association. Because, we talked a little bit off air, but, I mean, there was a lot of pain points that you saw and ways to improve this. But really talk what what is the heart behind the National Dump Truck Association?
Malcolm Smith:
The heart behind the National Dumps well, when I was, you know, doing my growing my company, starting on my first 2 years were were oh my god. They were terrible. It it was I didn't know anything. I didn't know enough I didn't have enough information. I I didn't know who to talk to. I didn't have a resource to there was no mentor or anything. So it was like, what what you know, just trial and error, and you go through a lot of things during trial, and you lose a lot of money. You have a bunch of hiccups that you shouldn't have, and there was nobody to talk to about it.
Malcolm Smith:
And I saw the way the industry was was going. There was a lot of, I'll say, bad business going on, in dump trucking. And we we really, set out just to be a resource for people who wanna get into the industry as well as people who are already in the industry that need to tighten up their business, tighten up their big business acumen, have products that are available to them. So, you know, if you wanna grow and sustain your business, you can, such as insurance. We have captive policies. We have, it's so many different things. We'll we'll be here all day just talking about it. But, I just saw a need in the industry for for someone like a like a a center or association where you could you could just call and talk to somebody about the industry even if that's just to make you feel better.
Malcolm Smith:
You know? We we have people on standby that can help you navigate through, you know, a a bunch of different things that you may get into in in dump trucking. Flat tires, I'm stuck here. I need a tow here, or I need to be pulled out of a a ditch. Like, what what do you do? It's it's a industry that's that's not really talked about. And, you know, getting out there, you won't you won't know until you get into it. And I think that's why sometimes it gets a bad rap because people get into it, not enough information, and they fail. And then it's in, I don't wanna do it anymore. But once you get into it and you hit it the right way, it's a it's a beautiful industry.
Malcolm Smith:
Beautiful.
Jared Flinn:
Well, talk about for people that maybe not be that aren't in the industry. You talked about, like, the the bad business that that sometimes it can go on. What is that bad business?
Malcolm Smith:
That bad business is you you contact you contact a company, and they say, hey. Can you do this job for a $100? Sure. Alright. III just I'm just trying to keep keep the wheels turning. So I agreed to do the job, and then at end of the job, it's like the companies, they stop answering your calls. They start getting calls. They don't they don't you know, there's no more connection, and it's like, how do I get paid? Like, I I've done the job for you guys for a week. We, you know, laid asphalt.
Malcolm Smith:
I'm owed about $2, 000. How do I get my payment? And a lot of companies, you know, I'll say the reputable companies, they don't do this, but, you know, you have a couple companies who still are doing bad business and they will just get ghost and stop answering and drag on payment for for months months in in dump trucking. If you're a, you know, small business, you can't afford to go 30 to 60 to 90 days without being paid. And
Jared Flinn:
Yeah.
Malcolm Smith:
That's the type of bad when I when I got into the business, my first 2 years, I came across a lot of that. I I had to send a lot of letters, certified letters to companies. I've had to get lawyers involved just to get payment, and it's it's shouldn't be that way. That's what gives the business a bad rap. And and I think that, you know, us being national, we we can help, you know, kinda edge out that type of business and and really grow the right way. I you know, it it the companies that we deal with, this just the name, if you see that we Matthews, which in Georgia, see that Matthews, Brett Scarborough, they're doing business the right way. And I think that should be, you know, consistent across the board. You know?
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. Well, it it's funny you bring that up. I'll I wanna give this example, and I'd like for you to expand. You know, we started a factoring business back in 2014, and I kid you not, 1 of our very first customers was a construction company. Well, it was a dump truck that was hauling for a construction company, and I'm not gonna name the location, but dump truck was hauling the loads, sent us the tickets, we paid the trucker, we send the invoice to a construction company, nothing. Wouldn't pay us.
Malcolm Smith:
Yes.
Jared Flinn:
And then they came back and said, no. Those those, you know, those hours are incorrect, the wrong build. And make a short story, like, we ended up having to eat those dollars because we did pay them to the trucker, and so the trucker got paid. But the company, we didn't have anything in writing or anything certified that that they owed us that money, and we always chalk it up that it was, you know, graduation or tuition. I mean, you know, learning a learning lesson in that, but it was a it was a wake up call to be like, hey. Here's legitimate documents that this company hauled this. I think it was maybe about an hour or whatever, and we ended up, eating a considerable amount of that money. And I think that's kinda what you alluded to.
Jared Flinn:
But, yeah, I'm not I'm not saying it happens at all, but, yeah, it just seems like and I think maybe in other trucking, like, where we do bulk trucking for all over the road and all that. Not saying it can't happen there, but, Yeah. It was a wake up call or 1 of our first experiences to to being careful about, you know, the the factoring money to companies and making sure that you get that back.
Malcolm Smith:
Yes. And, you know, the the the 1 thing I tell the members is if a company doesn't send you a hauler's agreement when you first contact them, that that's pro that's almost like a red flag because most legit companies are gonna set you up with a hauler's packet. And that's, you know, the agreement that, hey. We'll be doing this job. You'll be paid on this day. You'll be paid either ACH or cash. It's gonna lay all that out and let you know when you'll be paid, how you'll be paid. They may take your, you know, your your account number so they can, send it through direct the right deposit.
Malcolm Smith:
But, Hauler's agreement, when they ask you for a Hauler's agreement, that's pretty much a tells a sign that they are a legit company, and that's how you can kinda weed out. Alright. This is weird. Why didn't they contact me and talk about pay? Or why didn't they contact me and say, how are you gonna be paid? Because that's the that's 1 of the most important things. So, yes, that that is it's it's a lot of that that goes on. And, I think, you know, we we really can can minimize. I'm not gonna say it's gonna stop, but the 1 thing we're really, building on is our education. We we love educating the truckers.
Malcolm Smith:
We love educating our our members. And, like, I tell them, it's not about me. Like, I am it's it's about the team that we have, the the people that's involved. It's it's a bunch of high level people who have done business for years. We have, high level advisers. It's it's it's it's not about me at all. It's it's the team that we have that we put you in front of. We have we we partner with banks.
Malcolm Smith:
They come and do webinars about financial literacy, about how to get, ready for buying a dump truck. Because a lot of times, members is, I wanna buy a dump truck. Okay? What's your credit look like? Do you have any money for down payment? Do you have any history? They walked them through that, and they helped them get to the the the pinnacle they because a lot of times they get there and and then they get, oh, man. I can't get the truck. Well, no. We're gonna put you in touch with Regions Bank, or we're gonna put you in touch with Equifax or these type of companies that can help you and walk you through the process. So when it's time, you won't have any issues. So that's the education is really what we're we we lead with, and and making it a safer industry too because our safety and compliance is is top tier.
Malcolm Smith:
We have a director of safety and compliance who is oh, man. He's he's amazing. So I keep I keep reintegrating that, and I could talk about it. I get really, like, energetic because it's just some good great things we're doing, and and it's, again, it's not about me. It's the team that we have. It's it's crazy.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. No. Absolutely. Malcolm, just from your experience, especially in the dump truck world, you talk about guys getting into the industry. Most of those guys, and I know they can be all different, but is it is it usually drivers that were hauling for somebody else and they wanna get their own dump truck? But, like, most of the people that you're talking to, experiencing, what got them into dump trucking in the beginning?
Malcolm Smith:
Sometimes it's it's, they were drivers. They started off maybe driving somewhere else. Maybe, let's for an example, let's say, a city bus. You may have started driving the city bus, or it may have been a school bus driver. And they said, I can probably make more money driving a dump truck. So, you know, I went and start driving for a company, and then I guess over time, they say, like, man, I wanna do this full time and do it for myself. And that's where the hurdle comes in. How do you do it? Where do you get the information? Where do you get the education? And where is somebody helping me with my business acumen, learning how to sell, learn how to go contracts, learning how to look like a legit business and not something that's just put together and rushed.
Malcolm Smith:
And I think by us doing that, people are taking it more serious instead of, you know, dump truck drivers have never really had the, I guess, history of of having the best business acumen, but that's what we're doing for them. We're, you know, polishing them up. And this is, you know, what the contractors, the government, and who given the government state contract, this is what they wanna see because they won. A lot of people aren't qualified. And so just give them that that opportunity, I think, has really helped them, and they and they they really love it.
Jared Flinn:
Can you talk about too for again, for someone listening to this podcast that, may be interested in dump trucking, doesn't know kind of the the landscape, but about how it works. Know, and there's different types of dump trucking, I mean, as far as hauling different products and all that. But if we can kinda limit up, like, most dump trucking would if you're hauling and say for an asphalt job or they're laying asphalt, is it paid by the hour? Is it paid by the load? Like, how does I mean, how does the numbers work, you know, financially? How the how the dump truck's making money?
Malcolm Smith:
So it's 3 ways. You could be paid by the hour. You can be paid by the tonnage, so that's the amount that you're carrying, and or you can be paid by the load. When you're going by the load, they don't really account how much you're you're you're really carrying. It's just really by the load. How much how much ever you get, that's how much ever you get. By the load, that's where the the how much you're carrying matters. So they may say, hey.
Malcolm Smith:
$5 a load. And let's say if you're hauling 17 tons times $5 times 17 tons, that's how much that load is gonna pay out. And within that, you have to decide, okay. If I wanna make $800, how many loads do I have to do at that that weight 17 tons? Because the rate is $5 a ton. How many loads do I have to do to to that $800? Then you have by the hour, and a lot of people love by the hour because it's, you know, sweet. You just as long as you keep hauling and and stay consistent, you know, it's no really no rush and, you know, you wanna be safe. But as long as that truck is out there working and and staying consistent, it's gonna get paid.
Jared Flinn:
So I guess, you know, I'm gonna reject right there because I I see a lot of, I should say, you know, what I noticed just going up and down the road, especially asphalt jobs, just just if we're stuck on that 1. But sometimes these jobs, you'll see 20 dump trucks all lined up waiting, you know, unload. And it's like, I always look at that and, like, man, I hope those guys are being paid by the hour, not by the load because don't know how fast that's turning in. It's me going down the highway and just looking over there, but, like, man, some of those guys, they might be sitting there for a long time before they get a load. So, hopefully, that's an hourly job.
Malcolm Smith:
Yes. Most times when you see that, it it is hourly. When you see more like, 20 or more trucks, it it has to be hourly because sometimes we will go out there, And let's say the days were 8 hours, you may do 2 or 3 shifts. I mean, you may do 2 2 or 3 loads, just because of the nature of how many trucks. Each truck has to get into the asphalt spreader, dump the asphalt, go back to the asphalt plant if they're not getting mill ins. So sometimes they will do what they call mill and fill. You mill well, you'll lay the asphalt and then you'll mill, which is like breaking up the as the old asphalt so it can be resurfaced surfaced by the asphalt, the new asphalt. So sometimes we will do that, but most times it's hourly.
Malcolm Smith:
And long as, again, long as you, you know, stay consistent and you're not, sitting around at a at a gas station just chilling, sleep, or something like that, you know, everything works out.
Jared Flinn:
I guess the big question I wanna ask when it really comes to this is talking about the money that can be made. I think that's what everybody was saying, like, hey. If I get into dump trucking, you know, how much can I make doing this? Because it is in my mind, it can be very seasonal. You know? So, I mean, as well, you know, in certain areas, they're not laying asphalt in the winter months, so it's slower or there's certain times of the year you get bad weather where it may stop a job for a while, so you're not running there. So it just seemed like there's just a lot of ups and downs, no pun intended, talking about dump trucking. But, like, can you just give us a scope of, like, what somebody could potentially make? I mean, if they if they get in this business, how much that 1 driver, 1 truck can walk home with at the end of the year?
Malcolm Smith:
I'll say this, and I always use I say 1 truck could easily get you a 100 k at the end of the year. 1 truck. And now, you know, with those k. Like This
Jared Flinn:
When you say 100 k, is that gross revenue, or is that after all expenses paid?
Malcolm Smith:
That's that's gross revenue. That and when I say that's just that's just working day shift, maybe 6, 7 months out of the year. You have night work as well. So that's another added revenue you can add on. So I I like to give people, like, examples because, you know, I don't wanna just you know, you can make a 125, 000. That, you know, that's not accurate. I'll say this, a 100 k day shift, 6 months out 6 to 7 months out of the year easily. That that is not hard at all.
Malcolm Smith:
But I'll say this, you're right. It is seasonal, but knowing the business of it, you you will understand this. You have to move and and haul different materials at different times. So, yes, asphalt is this is asphalt season right now. When it's warm, you know, everything is is is going good. As soon as it gets cold, asphalt shuts down because and don't quote me. I think it's 45 degrees or lower. They don't lay asphalt.
Malcolm Smith:
Yep. But that that that comes when you know it's getting cold, that's when you start to put trucks on different materials such as sand, such as concrete, such as gravel. That stuff moves in the rain. That stuff moves when it's cold. That stuff moves pretty much all year round. Concrete plants concrete plants need materials to keep making the concrete. So they will go in to the quarries, and they'll, you know, they'll do, what they call backhogs. They will, you know, just well, stockpiles.
Malcolm Smith:
Sorry. Stockpiles. Well, you can just go and do stockpiles, all day and and make a group you know, a a good amount of money from just stockpiles. But the the money's there. It's just knowing the business and knowing when to move. A lot of people say, yeah, it's only 7 8 month 9 month thing. Not really if you know what materials to move. So I was on the job last year.
Malcolm Smith:
My my company, JHM, we were pretty much running year round, because we got on the sand contract, and the sand was moving year round. If it rained, didn't matter the sand still was moving. So once you learn the industry, you can you can better maneuver through the business. And this is what we're teaching, our members. And and, you know, they are really saying, like, okay. Alright. I I see the the difference. So
Jared Flinn:
Some people focus on the negative rather than, you know, you can go buy a truck. You can try to start a business. There's entrepreneurs everywhere and small business runs America. They're the biggest employer. And yeah, it might not work out. You might fail, but at least you have the opportunity to go try it on a level playing field. Where some countries, you won't even have that opportunity. You won't have the freedom to even attempt to do anything like that.
Jared Flinn:
You know, right, wrong, or indifferent, and there's there's plenty of negatives we could go into if we want. Both, you know, your perspective, my perspective, how the country's run, and some people share that stuff a little too much. But at the end of the day, we should all be grateful that we're here and we have the opportunities we have and the freedoms we enjoy. And remember that, you know, it's because people decided to sign on that dotted line and decided that, you know what, There's something worth protecting. There's something worth doing here. And didn't didn't give up and sit on the sidelines.
Malcolm Smith:
That's awesome.
Jared Flinn:
Marcus, when you said that a 100 k gross revenue, so that's all all revenue made. But if you look at expenses, like, what is that driver really making at the end of the day? Like, how much is he clearing of that 100 k?
Malcolm Smith:
So it really depends on how his business is set up. And when when I said the 100 k, that was just minimum. Like, you you really can do that with ease. To give an example, you can do day work 1, 000 to 1500 a day as well as turnaround night work. Let's say you bring in another 1, 000 in night work. So a 100 k is easy. That that is that's that's that's probably working 3 days a week. You know? But if I had just say a 100 k in somebody's business, it it depends on the truck.
Malcolm Smith:
It depends if their truck is new, newer, they're, you know, gonna I have higher expenses. Insurance is gonna be a little bit higher. The field may be a little bit better, but it's, it really depends on how their business is set up. If someone has a truck that's paid off, that whole maybe that whole 100 k is I mean, maybe 10 k, 20 k is is, you know, maybe depleted and 80 k is into their pocket. But, I I don't wanna just throw a number and say, oh
Jared Flinn:
No. I guess what I'm just saying, if somebody's listening to this thinking about it and seeing that, hey, there might be an opportunity there. And again, yes. I mean, just like if when somebody asked me, hey, Jared. What's, you know, what's a good rate per month? I'm like, well, it really depends on where you're at and time of year and, you know, type of equipment. That's just a hard 1 to say. But I guess it's just if someone's looking at this saying, hey. You know, across the board, if I were to figure out, you know, if I had to get a dump truck, you know, can I make, you know, can I make a good living starting out, you know, making, you know, 50, 60 k after all expenses? You know?
Malcolm Smith:
Oh, easy. Is that okay. Easy. III would give you this, and I'll say that 1 of my trucks, it was it had some issues. It was it was just a for that truck, it was just a bad year for that truck. It was had suspension problems. It's just things that came out of nowhere. We were doing PM, and just we couldn't catch it.
Malcolm Smith:
But it was down half the year, and it still made a 120, 000 gross.
Jared Flinn:
Down Wow.
Malcolm Smith:
Half a year, it was down and still made 120. So that's the that in dump trucking is, you know, it's it's really about the consistency. If I can work 4 days, 5 days, and then turn around and put that truck at night work, then that's even more. And that truck didn't work any nights that year last year. It worked it was just strictly daytime. And half the year, and it's still put in on 20. So that's just to give you an example of the numbers in dump trucking. It's really, really, really, really lucrative.
Jared Flinn:
And, yeah, it's good you mentioned that you talked about because, yeah, dump trucking versus a lot of other trucking. I mean, yeah. There's a lot of work that can be done around the clock. Like, yeah, you go out to these highway jobs and Yeah. Trucks running all night long when traffic's low and all that. I would assume and I know you're not, you know, you're not the guy to talk to about regulation. I mean but you might know this, but, I mean, dump truck drivers have the same hours of operation, right, as a as an over the road driver. Is it a 10 10 hour max? Are there different rules for dump truck?
Malcolm Smith:
We are held up we are held on the same rules as as for the f but you do have some work around. Dumptucks really aren't they're not really scrutinized for working more than 10 hours or something. I mean, I've seen guys work 2 shifts, day shift and a night shift. Now it's not is it safe? No. But we're we, you know, we we what we're doing, we're we're encouraging our members to put EODs and cameras in their trucks, and these EODs will start to, you know they already are keeping up with their time and how much the truck is running. But I think it's it's making the industry safer because we have had things where guys push it to the limit. They try to go day shift, night shift, and I I get it. I understand it.
Malcolm Smith:
The the money's there. It's like, man, I I gotta get it. But sometimes they may fall asleep at the wheel. That's how you start having the the overturned dump trucks and all the materials. So so we are we are preaching EODs and and cameras. We wanna make the industry safe. And so we we we are we are holding them to that 10 hour. Hey.
Malcolm Smith:
10 hours is good. Come back tomorrow and do another 10 hours. Get some sleep. Get some rest. Don't try to push it. The work is still gonna be here. And, you know, don't don't because I this is how I look at it. If you go 5 days a week on day shift, how many extra shifts are you gonna really truly be able to do if you're doing day and night? You gotta sleep sometimes.
Malcolm Smith:
Something is gonna Some 1 1 of the like, it maybe 2 more shifts, maybe. I mean, if you 3 of you, III don't think that's worth the risk of losing your life and your health. So
Jared Flinn:
Absolutely. Yeah. I wanted to talk to you. It was months ago, I was, talking to a company down in that area. I think they're Florida, and I would think that it's nationwide, but they were saying it it's it was hard to find dump trucks to purchase. Like, the demand was sky high for them. And I think buying new trucks, like, you just can't find dump trucks to purchase. Is that, I mean, is that still the case? Is there a is there a high demand right now and not a lot of availability out there for purchasing?
Malcolm Smith:
There is a high demand for dump trucks, but what's what is crazy, there aren't enough of them, and that's what that's what the issue is. And and economy has pushed the newer trucks up so high. Like, a a new dump truck is 275. Who who's gonna be able to get a loan for 275? And
Jared Flinn:
this that in a normal market? I mean, before COVID and the industry
Malcolm Smith:
COVID, you could get AAA brand dump truck for about 125. 125 to 150. That
Jared Flinn:
So more than almost double the price?
Malcolm Smith:
Yes. That is that is that is the so that's why the gems are the older trucks. It's yeah. You you the the maintenance, yeah, it's a little bit more taxing on maintenance, but the 1 thing we're putting together, we like, we have a nation nationwide roadside service, that will come out tires, fluids, PM, whatever you need. They will come out and do it for you. And so it's so dump truck bundle. You pay 6.75 a year. You have roadside service.
Malcolm Smith:
You have a flat tire. They send somebody to to change the tire. You just pay for the tire. If you need a tow, the first 2 hours of your tow is free. Dump trucks, we really never go out 2 hours, but I'm not gonna say anything. So, you know, it it's we we're putting stuff together to help with the older trucks. And and, you know, I I have older trucks. I love them.
Malcolm Smith:
I'm gonna be honest. I have, I'd love the o sevens. So that's that's the what I bought. I I have 1 that's A05, but mostly o sevens, they have been great to me. I love Mack. The Mack is a great brand. Reminds me of I call it the Honda, or the Toyota, the Camry.
Jared Flinn:
Oh, yeah.
Malcolm Smith:
The workhorse, you know, hon Honda's goal a 1000000 miles. You know? So I I consider, the the the Mac is a workhorse, and it you know, the engines that come in, they're they're very strong. They're, they're rear end is strong. The transmission the Allison transmission is strong. So, the older trucks are the gems, and I guess I guess maybe finding older trucks is is is a little tough. So, yeah, I could see it being an issue. But like anything else, I I think we we you you can find them if you just go to the right spot.
Jared Flinn:
As far as we talked in the very beginning, but I wanted to again, this centers around you're talking about how much somebody could make, but then just the work that's available. You know, I I don't think I've ever asked this on a podcast before because it's always I always say our company can help, but we don't really do bulk, like dump truck loads. I mean, some of the stuff could be hauled in dump truck, but most we're dealing with in dumps and hoppers, walking floors, stuff that's getting trucked. We're not dealing with the local shipments. But for someone that's looking for work, you know, in a market, yeah, I think, you know, call in general general contractor construction, asphalt companies, and all that, but is are there any websites or places people can go to see if work's available in their area?
Malcolm Smith:
Yes. And we are rolling that out very soon. And I'm not just gonna sell the associate. I just because I I don't really, there is I hit their website. Not not really, but we have partnered with the DOTs in the country, all the DOTs in every state to get the local and and state bid. So that's federal DOT then with the local and state. We're we're carving away, in in different states and different cities to to, you know, be able to get those opportunities and disseminate those opportunities to our members. And so that's the 1 key that we saw.
Malcolm Smith:
Okay. We can get them ready, but what happens when they need work opportunities? Yeah. We can say, hey. We can teach you how to give them in, hey. It's on your own, but, you know, we we really wanna be able to help them all the way from a to z and and be able to put money into their pockets. Because if we don't do that, it doesn't it doesn't make sense as an association. So we, really have, we're about to roll out a a process of having, bids and work and government contracts and and of that nature to be able to give to the members. So
Jared Flinn:
Well, speaking about government contracts, I know that a lot of times, government contracts, they want, a lot of times, they get rewarded, like, minority owned companies. Are are there big opportunities for that for
Malcolm Smith:
Yes. Yes.
Jared Flinn:
Minorities in dump trucking and being getting on jobs?
Malcolm Smith:
Yes. That's the easiest way as a minority to get work is if, you know, you have your DB certification, which we help with that as well. We help with DB certification. We have somebody that will file it for you, that will do it the right way. But also
Jared Flinn:
information being being certified minority owned. Is that what that is?
Malcolm Smith:
Yes. Yes. Okay. Yes. It's it could be a long process, and it it could be really daunting. And and we we simplified it for people. I remember, with my company, and I I did all the process myself. And so I remember it was so taxing.
Malcolm Smith:
But, yes. There's a lot of jobs because companies need the DB participation, for a lot of their jobs. And so a lot of times, it's 25%, 30%, whatever it may be. And so you can get on into that percentage and and offer your services, and that's the easiest way to separate yourself from the pool of all the dump truck drivers.
Jared Flinn:
Well, yeah. Because, I mean, I I just think a dump trucking, especially, there's so many of these road jobs. I mean, road jobs or government jobs. I mean, so and there's gotta be a lot of good opportunity for minority owned companies to take advantage of that.
Malcolm Smith:
Yes. The DOT work is definitely big on on that. And there's been a there's there's been an influx of data centers that are being put up, all across the country, and these data centers are are being attached to DB I mean, well, I say participation of that that nature. I just wanna specifically say DB. It's a bunch of different things that play into the participation, but they have been asking for, my own minority contract I mean, minority companies that are certified so they can, be able to get that participation and and utilize it. So, yeah, it's a lot of lot of different work, but you you have to kinda be in that world to understand it, and that's what we are, again, giving the information to our members so they can be prepared.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. Well, just to kinda close out here, Marcus, just to speak to our audience, and, and we're gonna put your your website and your link. So if you're listening to the the podcast right now, especially if you're on YouTube or really Spotify, Apple, you'll be able to drop down in the show notes below, and you'll have all the links to just click, and it'll take you right to the National Dump Truck Association. But, yeah, it sounds like, Malcolm, you guys are just a, man, have a whole a la carte of of opportunities for someone if they're just trying to get into the business, learn more about it, to to do that. But, yeah, I guess, just just to sum it up, just speaking to our audience, what would you say, like, if I'm out there, you know, maybe what I'm doing right now is not working. I wanna get in dump trucking. What's the next step?
Malcolm Smith:
The next step is to, number 1, sign up for 1 of our webinars. 1 of our webinars is the easiest way to get you access to our membership. It's it's it's like a segue. Once you pay for it, you get a free month of membership. We we send you a free ebook. We do a 1 on 1 consultation with you to see where you're at in your business. You may have trucks. You may, you know, have 2 or 3 trucks, and just the business is beating you down right now.
Malcolm Smith:
So we we spend that time with our our members and and give them that 1 on 1 attention so we can put them in the right direction within our organization. But, if you wanna get into dump trucking, you can just start start with a a webinar. Come on in. Or if you just say, hey. I don't I don't I don't need the education. Hey. I I just wanna come and be a member. Hey.
Malcolm Smith:
Come on. We can you can, go on our website at the NDTA dot org. So the NDTA dot org. You also can go to what we call our AMS system, we because it's we have 2 different systems that we've kinda run our organization with. You can go to membership dot the NDTA dot org. So those 2 right there will definitely get you, in the game, and we have social media. So look for National Dump Truck social, all social platforms, Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn. You know, join join all our platforms.
Malcolm Smith:
We have a podcast. I don't mean to kinda throw a podcast out. Love for love for you to come on and talk about on our podcast, but we have a podcast called the Holler's Hub. It's, under our brand of the National Dump Truck Association on YouTube. But, yeah, man, we we're definitely come come join us. We're doing some great things. You got a bunch of free things to to get you started, a ebook that was written by me, but not just me, other industry experts. And I think that's what has separated us.
Malcolm Smith:
Again, it's not about me. It's the other experts that we have a part of this, the the the high level advisers we have, the the the lawyers, the the insurance advisers, the, it's so many. Director of compliance, the banks, the financial institutes, the the mechanics. There's so many different pieces of our organization that is is it just come together and made a a great group. And so please come take advantage. If I had this when I started, I I don't think I was a struggle as long as I did the first 2 years. That's
Jared Flinn:
good. That's really good. Yeah. I'm glad you brought up that too because I, actually, I got on your social media, and and you put together some really good videos. Just, I mean, I love just the short videos that you've even had on just different items and demonstrations. So, yeah, make sure and follow their social media. Marcus, you or I said Marcus Malcolm, you do an excellent job of putting great content out there for for listeners. And, yeah, to be I'd be honored to be on your all's podcast as well.
Jared Flinn:
So, yeah, definitely hit me up, and, be glad to join you there. So, Malcolm, I just wanna thank you for coming on the the podcast, man. You can tell your heart is in it. Again, for those operators out there, I think we always, we learn from our pains and mistakes, and you're really out there to help those out there not make the mistakes that you made
Malcolm Smith:
Yeah.
Jared Flinn:
Along the way. And, again, I think it's 1 of those kind of quiet industries that nobody really knows or talks about. And within that, I mean, there can be a lot of mistakes and people get taken advantage of, and I think you're kind of flushing that out and really promoting as a great industry to be in and really creating best business practices. So I I really commend you on that. So, man, I just wanna sum up. Thank you so much, Malcolm, for coming on the bulk loads podcast. God bless you.
Malcolm Smith:
Thank you. I appreciate you. And, hey. We definitely wanna have you on, man, because you you come with a lot of knowledge, lot of hey. We we we're we're talking this.
Jared Flinn:
Absolutely. Sounds good. Thank you. Thank you. Tyler, you said this right in the very beginning, but I just wanna bring that up to the forefront because that's 1 thing I've always seen from an an outside lens of kind of, I guess, the bad business in dump trucking. And I I know guys in our area that run construction companies that hire dump truck companies. And, yeah, it just seems like you gotta be careful who you're working with. And especially when you're dealing like bulk commodities, when you're dealing with grain and all that, it's very I don't know.
Jared Flinn:
It's a little more black and white, but I think dump trucking when you're dealing with working by the hour
Tyler Allison:
Yep.
Jared Flinn:
And job sites. And, again, you got weather factors playing in there that it can be sometimes not favorable to the actual trucking company. So you gotta be really careful. And I think like what he said, like, get a contract upfront, make sure you got something written in stone. Don't just start hauling, assuming everything's on the up and up and then find out that things are different.
Tyler Allison:
Yeah. Yeah. Gave pointers out how to look for those reputable companies. That way, you don't get burned. But, yeah, it was a great episode. We'll we will link, the National Dump Truck Association's website below. They are really education focused. Kind of remind me of, you know, what we're kind of trying to do here with the podcast specifically is just create that community, a free resource for guys to get involved in and just learn learn about the bulk industry.
Tyler Allison:
That way they can stay up to date with education.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. So drop down below. You can go right to, Malcolm, their website, and he's got membership options. And he drives a lot on social media, so I think there's a lot of just small educational things that he puts out there for people to know, that, that's just beneficial for a dump truck. So, yeah, definitely check that out. Before we tail out, just a couple announcements, truck show season.
Tyler Allison:
Yep. Yep. We will have guys up in, the Waukesha, Iowa, the I80 Jamboree Show, July 11th through 13th. We will actually have a booth there with Smart Freight Funding. So if you guys are there, let us know. We'll have some guys. We'd love to drop you off some swag, visit with you, even take a tour. If you have a truck in the show, capture some content, and promote that, free charge for you.
Tyler Allison:
We also have guys in Miami, Oklahoma, that same weekend. I think Rigs at the Run is what it's called. It's another truck show. So if you're gonna be at either of those shows, let us know. That way, we can make sure to meet up with you, maybe grab some grab a bite to eat or, give you some swag.
Jared Flinn:
You can go to the show and then pick up a load of drag sand right there in Pitcher.
Tyler Allison:
I mean,
Jared Flinn:
it's just right. And if you know if you know the area, you know exactly what I'm talking about. It's a huge area that, a lot of drag sand comes out of. So, cool. There was something else we were gonna mention.
Tyler Allison:
Yeah. We just wanna highlight the video shoots in. Joe, man, he's just amazing. Joe on our team is just really good at what he does, and he is traveling around the US right now with his camera, and he's just visiting, trucking companies and bulk loads of members, all over the US, and we want to provide the opportunity for your company to be highlighted. Again, it's just gonna take an hour or 2. We'll schedule a time for Joe to come out to your operation, and we just wanna simply highlight what you do and capture, the the operation that you're running, whether it's a 1 truck owner operator or, you know, you run a fleet of trucks or even if you're a shipper or broker. Let us know, if you would like the opportunity for us to come out and and, capture some content.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. The biggest cost is gonna be just your time. Well, I mean, actually, that's your only cost is your time. We do this, we put this together. Believe it or not, you most custom most of our members, our customers, business owners do this video shoot. It helps promote your company, and we promote it through our social media. And again, it's just a we think it's a good thing. Obviously, we'd love to do it to highlight our members, but man, this can be very good for your business to help people know who you are.
Jared Flinn:
And you just don't know who might be list or watching that video that reaches out to you to say, hey. I see that you're based out of wherever, and we do we do freight there. So, man, let
Tyler Allison:
Actually, there was a not to interrupt you, but there's a cool story that we just heard from, K2 Logistics. Joe went out and did a cool video shoot. He did a, he put together a little YouTube short with, Tucker Carlson, and Mike contacted us and said, dude, I've had, like, 3 or 4 people contact me just from that little YouTube short that was put out, of people, you know, asking if they can come work for me or I think he even had some customers reach out. So that just shows you the impact that it actually has.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. Yeah. So, again, reach out to us. We'd love to do that video. You will not be disappointed.
Tyler Allison:
Yep. Let us know on social media or just, simply comment down below or, email us podcast@bulkloads. Com.
Jared Flinn:
Yeah. And I'm sure you get, get the alerts, but make sure and subscribe to our channel because that Rob Grover 1 Joe just pushed out last week, the 4th July is amazing. That K21. Yeah. Just a really, really cool video. So, yeah, make sure and subscribe so you can see those. So, with that said, oh, yeah. I was gonna say, if you haven't been watching, you don't know, but we offer prayers for people and our listeners.
Jared Flinn:
You can simply email prayer at bulk lows.com. I wanna just highlight and, we had a request individual just praying over their church and, rebuilding their sanctuary.
Tyler Allison:
Yep.
Jared Flinn:
And we, we are praying over that. So thank you for sending that in. But, yeah, any prayer within your community, within your family, within your business, we wanna be praying for you. And, man, we would just love to have that opportunity. So cool. With that said, I'll close this out. Heavenly father, we love you. Lord, we thank you for this day.
Jared Flinn:
Lord, we thank you for blessing us, and allowing us to bless others in this industry. Lord, we know that there are, people out there with challenges and needs, and Lord, we just, petition those prayers up to you, Lord, that, that you see and, Lord answer those prayers. Lord, we thank you for the, just the trucking and agribusiness community and, everything that you provide. And, Lord, I wanna say just on and specifically on this prayer, Lord, if there's someone out there that doesn't know or has a relationship with you, Lord, that today be the day, that they find you and that they establish a relationship with you, Lord. God, we thank you for this time. Lord, we thank you for this community and, thank you for all that you do. Amen. Amen.
Jared Flinn:
Thank Thank you as always for listening to the Bulk Loads podcast. Again, don't forget to subscribe. If you know someone that could benefit from this, do us a favor, please share this out there on your social media. We would be very thankful for that. Thank you very much. And as always, God bless.
